请教汉英论坛专家
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大都 于 2000/01/16 01:53:25 发表在 汉英
我和朋友们正在编写一些讽刺小品，想请教贵坛或贵坛特聘的专家
拨冗帮忙，提供一些在编写讽刺小品时有可能用到的语言，内容包括：
（一）介绍一下英文中讲人无耻、不要脸的中英文表达法，都要。
（二）讽刺“敬酒不吃吃罚酒”方面的语汇和描述。
（三）提供一些有关无“自知之明”，“蚍蜉撼树”，和以损人开始，
以害己告终，或者您们随时想到的有关方面的中英语汇，我们都欢迎。
谢谢！
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先只想起这些，不过还没吃过饭 ……
作者：Alzheimer-expert - 2000/01/16 01:59:50
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English: without shame, shameless, unashamed he's so shameless, he would steal his own mother.
brazen,
brazen it out
brazen-faced
bold (in some context)
unabashed
中文：不要脸，厚颜无耻，厚脸皮，皮厚，不害臊
鞋店招聘新模特，不要脸。
拖了三遍还没拖干净，害臊（还扫）不？
皮厚的蚊子都不爱叮。
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Great! Some English additions.
作者：Owen - 2000/01/16 02:05:22
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pert, malapert, flip, flippant, cocky, fresh, cheeky, facy, crusty, gally, nervy, uncalled-for, brash, bluff; saucy, sassy...
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“敬酒罚酒”：You prefer stick to carrot, huh?
作者：Owen - 2000/01/16 02:08:44
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谢！有用都要，还有“先礼后兵”呢？
作者：大都 - 2000/01/16 02:15:01
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An olive branch before the sword.
作者：Owen - 2000/01/16 02:17:30
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Right! In some other languages it's palm instead of olive.
作者：forgot - 2000/01/16 02:18:51
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又是没吃饭前想起来的……
作者：alzheimer-expert - 2000/01/16 02:20:47
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敬酒不吃，吃罚酒。
熟饭不吃，吃生饭。
小猫不要，偏爱老虎。
兔子不要，等老虎。
乐团招人，甜的不要，要辣（拉）的。
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“有自知之明”的译法
作者：没我地球就不转 - 2000/01/16 02:28:34
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"know thy self," "know thy place," "know thy limitations," "prudent," "discreet," "judicious," "well-judged," "circumspect," "provident"...
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“没有自知之明”的译法
作者：没我地球就不转 - 2000/01/16 02:31:46
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"know thy self not", "impudent", "insolent", "presumptious", "presuming", "obtrusive", "overpresumptious"
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自知之明
作者：alzheimer-expert - 2000/01/16 02:37:07
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know yourself is to know what you can't.
know your possibilities and limitations.
What follows is not quite the same thing, but there's a connection somewhere. It's from old Shakespeare (i believe it's from King Lear):
have more than thou showest,
speak less than thou knowest,
lend less than thou owest,
ride more than thou goest,
learn more than thou trowest,
set less than thou throuwest;
leave thy drink and thy whore,
and keep in-a-door,
and thou shalt have more
than two tens to a score.
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Cool! Highly recommended for reading, everyone!
作者：古月 - 2000/01/16 02:38:55
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Source: King Lear Act I, sc. iv
作者：tian xin - 2000/01/16 15:45:44
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with one pedantic correction: throwest :)
中译（朱生豪）
多积财，少摆阔；
耳多听，话少说；
少放款，多借债；
走路不如骑马快；
三言之中信一语，
多掷色子少下注；
莫饮酒，莫嫖妓；
呆在家中把门闭；
会打算盘占便宜，
不会打算叹口气。
Here is a more memorable speech from Shakespeare, if you want to make pragmatism the rule of your life:)
Give thy thoughts no tongue,
Nor any unproportion'd thought his act.
By thou familiar, but by no means vulgar;
Those friends thou hast, and their adoption tried,
Grapple them unto thy soul with hoops of steel,
But do not dull thy palm with entertainment
Of each new-hatch'd, unfledg'd courage. Beware
Of entrance to a quarrel, but being in,
Bear't that th'opposed may beware of thee.
Give every man thy ear, but few thy voice;
Take each man's censure, but reserve thy judgment.
Costly thy habit as thy purse can buy,
But not express'd in fancy; rich, not gaudy;
For the apparel oft proclaims the man,
And they in France of the best rank and station
Are of a most select and generous chief in that.
Neither a borrower nor a lender be,
For loan oft loses both itself and friend,
And borrowing dulls the edge of husbandry.
This above all: to thine own self be true,
And it must follow as the night the day
Thou canst not then be false to any man.
--Hamlet Act I, sc iii
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“蚍蜉撼树”、“螳臂挡车”: Don Quixote's futile running against a windmill
作者：tentative - 2000/01/16 02:42:45
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蚍蜉摇树
作者：alzheimer-expert - 2000/01/16 02:45:26
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lift up an elephant with one arm
hold a breaking dam on your own
fight against the Russians with a handgranate (this one is from an old-film)
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“以损人开始，以害己告终”Jack's attempt to ruin the forum only backfired against himself
作者：the missing person - 2000/01/16 02:48:55
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alternatives...
作者：alzheimer-expert - 2000/01/16 03:03:09
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以损人开始，以害己告终:
harm set, harm get
harm watch, harm catch
dig a grave for others, and you shall fall into it yourself
those who set trap for others, will get self-trapped.
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有关“搬起石头砸自己的脚”的老帖
作者：管闲事的 - 2000/01/16 02:54:51
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(1)
论坛以前讨论过“搬起石头砸自己的脚”的译法。Here is the link:
http://www.bilinguist.com/data/hy00/messages/2114.html#2114
to shoot yourself in the foot;
to blow yourself with your own bomb;
to be hoist with your own petard (A little too old, though, from Shakespeare's Hamlet) (by 野草)
self-defeating；
cut the ground from beneath one's own feet (by Owen)
Shoot one's own foot, hurt oneself in one's own design (by sq)
to be hoist with one's own petard (Hope it doesn't happen to you:-) (by tian xin)
(2)
Another thread on "Those who live in GLASS houses shouldn't throw stones"
http://www.bilinguist.com/data/hy00/messages/2805.html#2808
Those who live in GLASS houses shouldn't throw stones
住玻璃屋还扔石头--活得不耐烦/自寻短见/自找苦吃。(by Last Hermit)
同住玻璃房，不应扔石头(砸人)。(by Owen)
损人不利己；害人害己。(by Lily)
别搬起石头砸自己的脚。(by 鹤子)
身囿玻璃屋，扔石必自毁。(by 野草)
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往事呈新
作者：正 - 2000/01/16 15:32:00
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多日不读帖，像落了许多功课，只好一目数页，仍然
收获不少，感慨不少！汉英真是人才济济，多文人骚客！
新旧网友的诗篇，更增添了色彩！
我喜欢Wordsworth的The Solitary Reaper，也喜欢古译
的《割麦的孤芳》。这首诗郁达夫也译过，诗句记不清了，
只记得题目是《高原的刈麦者》，少年读时，也陶醉过一
番，像喝了酒一样。
我想把古译遥寄给forgot，可是忘了地址。只好在这里
陶然一回！
倒是和大都通了话。大都有些杂事，一时不得脱身，托向新老
网友致谢！
古译贴在下面，以便网友。多读一遍，如多喝一盅酒，何乐不为！
试译一首诗献给各位歌吟男女：割麦的孤芳
作者：古月 - 2000/01/02 19:08:44 ***
割麦的孤芳
作者：威廉－华兹华斯
瞧，田间的她，孤伶伶，
山地妞妞，独自一人，
孤芳自赏，边割边吟，
请驻足，或走过时脚步轻轻；
她形单影只，割麦，扎捆，
伤感的曲韵随风伴云;
听，山谷深处，
回荡着她那悠扬的歌声。
动听的夜莺，
唱不出那种温情，
荒漠树荫下栖息的香客，
风尘仆仆，感受最深；
报春的杜鹃，
歌喉也不及那般揪心，
划破了海角的宁静
震撼着天涯的岛群。
那歌声难道真的没有知音？
莫非这悠扬而凄凉的曲韵，
唱的是辛酸的城南旧事，
还有久远久远的战争？
莫非这谦卑而平凡的旋律，
哼的是当今的家常琐闻？
冬去春来，周而复始，
悲欢离合，圆缺阴晴？
那孤芳，无论唱的是什么，
总好象吟不绝，唱不尽；
干活的时候还在唱，
挥镰的时候还在哼；
我静静地听，驻足入神；
直到我举步登上山顶，
歌声远远消逝在田间，
却仍在心底丝丝回萦。
The Solitary Reaper
William Wordsworth
Behold her, single in the field,
Yon solitary highland lass!
Reaping and singing by herself;
Stop here, or gently pass!
Alone she cuts and binds the grain,
And sings a melancholy strain;
O listen! for the Vale profound
Is overflowing with her sound,
No Nightingale did ever chaunt
More welcome notes to weary bands
Of travelers in some shady haunt,
Among Arabian sands;
A voice so thrilling ne'er was heard
In spring-time from the cuckoo-bird,
Breaking the silence of the seas
Among the farthest Hebrides.
Will no one tell me what she sings? --
Perhaps the plaintive numbers flow
For old, unhappy, far-off things,
And battles long ago;
Or is it some more humble lay,
Familiar matter of today?
Some natural sorrow, loss, or pain,
That has been, and may be again?
Whate'ver the theme, the Maiden sang
As if her song could have no ending;
I saw her singing at her work,
And o'er the sickle bending;--
I listen'd, motionless and still;
And, as I mounted up the hill,
The music in my heart I bore,
Long after it was heard no more.
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I listen'd, motionless and still, music from paradise, forgot to say thank you.
作者：tian xin - 2000/01/02 21:57:04 ***
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“花了力气译出的大诗人的诗，还是比自己写的质量高多了:-)” 谢提醒;)
作者：tian xin - 2000/01/04 15:15:53 ***
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哈哈哈。。。不要对号入坐嘛;)只适用于本人，不适用于tian xin、Shelley一档的大诗人:-)
作者：古月 - 2000/01/04 15:30:03 ***
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We also should remember that it only applies to great translators like Gu Yue:)
作者：tian xin - 2000/01/04 15:58:38 ***
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译得真美！Thanks for sharing!
作者：hz - 2000/01/04 17:30:51 ***
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被古月先生大作引动了诗兴,正巧以前译过楼下那首诗,略做改动,凑份子助兴。见笑！
作者：平 - 2000/01/05 18:10:14 ***
我独自飘荡着象一朵云
作者：威廉－华兹华斯
我独自飘荡着象一朵云
辽远地浮游在山谷的上面
蓦然间望见一群
一大片金色的水仙
在湖畔在树荫
微风里摇曳舞姿缤纷
绵绵相连好似繁密的群星
在天河里闪光眨眼
花儿铺展到无边的远境
沿着湾旁沿着水岸
千万朵扑涌进视野
婆娑起舞轻摇着笑靥
水波也在她身旁摇荡
花儿的喜悦胜却波光闪耀
诗人禁不住心意飞扬
置身在这欢快的围绕
我凝视着，凝视着，无遐思及
这一幕怎样地宝贵，惹人珍惜
我常常仰卧在床榻上
神思空空或冥想非非
就看见花儿在心里闪亮
那独处时光的沉醉
我的心于是漾满欢愉
随着水仙花翩然起舞
I Wandered Lonely as a Cloud
- William Wordsworth
I wandered lonely as a cloud
That floats on high o'er vales and hills,
When all at once I saw a crowd,
A host, of golden daffodils;
Beside the lake, beneath the trees,
Fluttering and dancing in the breeze.
Continuous as the stars that shine
And twinkle on the milky way,
They stretched in never-ending line
Along the margin of a bay:
Ten thousand saw I at a glance,
Tossing their heads in sprightly dance.
The waves beside them danced: but they
Out-did the sparkling waves in glee:
A poet could not but be gay,
In such a jocund company:
I gazed - and gazed - but little thought
What wealth the show to me had brought:
For oft when on my couch I lie
In vacant or in pensive mood,
They flash upon that inward eye
Which is the bliss of solitude;
And then my heart with pleasure fills,
And dances with the daffodils.
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Mmm....yummy! 令人心旷神怡，很喜欢这首诗的意境。多谢！
作者：古月 - 2000/01/05 18:16:01 ***
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How lovely to have such bilingual expression of such unfettered delight! Unfettered thanks!
作者：tian xin - 2000/01/05 19:02:12 ***
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补白：郁译是夹述在他的一篇小说中。
作者：正 - 2000/01/16 15:39:13
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旧帖刚过不久，就别翻出来啦！
作者：好奇者 - 2000/01/16 23:26:17
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让人臊得慌，那不是抛给俺的绣球让俺给接了，和尴尬的缪斯犯了同样的傻，让人多害臊啊！难道真是犯傻也会成双成对？
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咱喝多了，
作者：正 - 2000/01/17 00:34:13
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今天出口就错。要是您再驳我，我不是
对了错了，全要赔过。您知我，不要紧，万望
新朋友别见怪！
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别介意，正兄！那“好奇者”算是您的新朋友了。大家还是轻松点好吧。
作者：古月 - 2000/01/17 00:51:35
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谢谢您的厚爱重上旧帖。其实大家也就是新年高兴，随便乐乐而已。没有向谁抛绣球的意思，这您还不清楚吗？“好奇者”过虑了。也许是爱开个玩笑而已。
还惦记着您译的“长恨歌”哪！
古月
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再喝一盅！
作者：y - 2000/01/17 09:54:48
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是新朋友，更好了！这名字就很雅：
好奇者，为女子而大可也。正好和弊国先贤
的名言成个不协之音。
孔子说：唯女子与小人为难养也。
取意可嘉。时代不同了，改女子为好，亦大可也。
好奇兄，如蒙不弃，同喝一盅！
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达人自达酒何功，世间是非忧乐本来空（苏东坡）
作者：joking - 2000/01/17 20:10:08
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请问是那位东坡，出自何年何月何日何典？谢。
作者：正 - 2000/01/17 21:44:04
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For your reference
作者：clown - 2000/01/18 02:25:09
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薄薄酒，饮两钟，。。布，著两重，美恶虽异醉暖同。丑妻恶妾寿乃公，隐居求志义之从，本不计较东华尘，土北窗风。百年虽长要有终，富死未必输生穷。但恐珠玉留君容，千载不朽遭樊崇，文章自足欺盲聋，谁使一朝富贵面发红。达人自达酒何功？世间是非忧乐本来空。
－－宋·苏轼·《薄薄酒》
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我爱坡公。爱我坡公。先谢！忙。容后。
作者：正 - 2000/01/18 09:44:57
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i know u were "joking". how could that be 坡公！
作者：正 - 2000/01/18 16:12:51
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嗨！您反应还真快！
作者：古月 - 2000/01/18 01:07:05
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怎么就将那位的笔名拆成了了“女子大可”？真叫人笑破了肚皮！有您的！这段时间在出差，上网无规律。迟复为歉！补敬一盅吧！干！
古月
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还有“者”字：可拆作三：“土，老，日”。当然，kidding而已。谢好奇兄大度，容我等放恣。
作者：正 - 2000/01/18 02:14:00
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或拆作四：“土老一口”。一口者，一个也。kidding。一笑，谢过。就此打住。
作者：正 - 2000/01/18 02:18:25
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